“Hip Firing”

This last post got me thinking about the anti-rights saw of “Hip Firing”.

VPC has one of their great “studies” showing us how amazing it is!

First up they need to argue that semi-auto guns can be easily converted to full-auto, and somehow this is happening with some sort of frequency. Then with that hurdle stumbled over they show a bunch of pictures from OLD military training manuals on how to “Shoot From The Hip”.

Note the OLD part. Hip firing was taught to military members for quick-full-auto fire. The gun was pointed towards the target and the trigger was pulled, and the shooter would watch where their bullets impacted and “Walk” the gun onto target. This is still done with belt-fed machine guns (tho not from the hip because they’re heavy and kick like a mule), but not taught with assault rifles or sub-machine guns. Why? Well because you have between 6 and 10 seconds before your magazine runs dry, and spending any of that time “Walking” your gun onto target is depleting your magazine in a non-trivial amount. Hell just look at modern training, and how often full-auto is used.

Look at that, Digital-Camo BDUs, M4 Carbines, ACOG M68 Close Combat Optic (Thanks McThag, I know crap about glass!) scopes. This is the modern military training for battle. What don’t you hear? The chatter of full-auto fire. Also those ACOGs are fucking expensive, so they’re making sure their soldiers look through the damn things while they shoot!

Last it somehow seems that an extended pistol grip on a rifle is designed for “hip shooting”. Odd given that the pistol grip supplies such a natural grip when shooting a rifle with an in-line stock from the shoulder using the sights, but when you drop the rifle down to low ready you have to cock your wrist.

If you look at traditional rifle stocks it seems that the really old “Straight” stocks with no grip added at all will work the best as you can just grip the wrist of the rifle like you would the handle of a hammer to hold it low.

Of course I don’t know of any full-auto guns, or even semi-auto guns with a straight stock. Maybe because the designers never intended this as a mode of fire, and instead it was dreamed up by the tactical-Tommies before the idea got shot down by real-world shooting.

Oh well, maybe somebody will believe them….

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13 Responses to “Hip Firing”

  1. McThag says:

    Those are not ACOG. Those are M68 Close Combat Optic. Civvie name of Aimpoint Comp M4 (and a couple Comp M2 too).

    Other than looking entirely different, the other main clue is these guys are soldiers not marines.

  2. Stuart the Viking says:

    I agree, the pistol grip DOES make it less comfortable for “Hip Firing” (something I have been saying for YEARS). When the antis came up with this crap they were really showing that they don’t know what they are talking about. Their audience, however, are the “normal” people who are undecided on the issue and are mostly also uneducated on the subject. So little things like accuracy and reality aren’t considered.

    The BAR and the M14 both had traditional (“Straight” as you put it) stocks. I actually think the “Say hello to my little friend” scene (which was a BAR if I’m not mistaken) was where the antis got the whole idea of “Hip Firing”. They just added the pistol grip flap-trap later when the AR and AK became their enemy number one.

    Consequently, I have always wanted to own a BAR. Not sure why. There is no way I would be able to afford to FEED one if I got one and I have absolutely no use for one. I think sitting around as a little kid listening to war stories from the old men talking about being pinned down by Germans, then hearing the distinctive slow thudding sound of a BAR and knowing that help was on the way kinda romanticized it for me.

    But I sure as hell wouldn’t be “Hip Firing” it.


  3. Bubblehead Les says:

    Time for a little History. John Moses Browning (PBUH!) designed the BAR for the Trench Warfare of WW1. He sent some over to France to be Field Tested by his son Val. The WW1 Ammo Belt for the BAR had a metal Holder for the Butt Stock to be held in place whilst doing “Walking Fire.” My friend owned one, BTW. Having used it and an Ohio Ord Semi-Auto BAR back in my Reenacting Days, it did help with the weight of the BAR. Until you had to go prone. Then you just had a Big Heavy Gun to lug around. By the time WW2 rolled around, the Holder was removed from the latest Belt design. Also, Big Army learned the hard way that although the BAR was fine, having men walking across No-Mans Land VERTICALLY was not a good idea. Hope this helps.

  4. Bubblehead Les says:

    Oh, I forgot. The BAR was licensed for some countries overseas after the War. And Sweden put a Pistol Grip on their Design. Look for pictures of the BAR “D”.

  5. Kristopher says:

    Weerd … go to Oleg Volk’s blog, and look at the photo of a PPSH-41 he uses as a header.

  6. Joe in PNG says:

    One can also blame Hollywood. Shooting from the hip doesn’t hide the actor’s face like a proper hold would.

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