So I was talking this morning with Dragon of Dragon Leatherworks about potential areas to attack in the holster world. We got talking about what are odd holsters.
The big guys are strong-side belt carry (IWB or OWB) for guns like the 1911, Glock, or S&W J-Frame.
If those work for you, enjoy them, and a market filled with options for you. Let’s talk about the odd stuff, the stuff that’s a bitch for you to find holsters for.
I carry a 1911 and a J-Frame myself. Easy guns to find holsters for. I also carry the J-frame in a pocket holster, again, wicked easy (tho I recommend the DeSantis Nemesis) But I’m odd with my 1911, as I shoulder carry, shoulder rigs, especially horizontal ones like I prefer are more rare.
If I lived in a free state I’d totally pocket carry a Kahr PM45. As far as I can tell, while the gun is essentially the same size as my S&W642, nobody makes a pocket holster for it.
How about you? Do you carry (or would like to carry) an odd gun, or in an odd method?
Also because I’d like to see as much data as possible, do you have friends with odd guns, or odd carry methods?
Who knows, maybe your desire might be a new offering from Dragon Leatherworks!
Maybe guns with lights? If it’s not a Glock, you’re basically SOL in the current market. Your choices right now are either LEO-oriented (open carry with retention), mainstream manufacturers that take seven years to make it (Raven), or small independent kydex molders that may or may not know what they’re doing.
Nice leather holster offerings that will hold gun-mounted lights are only offered by one or two companies, and they probably take seven years, too.
I’d like a pocket holster for my electro-nic 442, that doesn’t flop out when I’m sitting in the mens’ room. Of course, that may be a function of ‘large-man, large pant pockets’.
My ex-gf carries a short Kimber 1911, in a belly-band, situated just below her chest. Draw is in between.
I’ll agree with ZK — lights/laser attachments seem to be the exception in holster availability.
And then there the whole issue of companies making holsters for just the top 5/10 best selling product lines. It is nearly impossible to find holsters for my Taurus PT-145 or Sig Sauer SP2009.
Maybe there is a market for using a rapid prototyping machine to off produce holsters.
The other area that I would like to see is mix and match. One retention system, multiple bodies. I really like my Cross Breed Super Tuck. It maintains position, is comfortable and secure but — it only has 1 Kydex shell for the PT145.
Why not be able to attach a shell for the Sig SP2009 one day and the shell for the Taurus the next day. It would lower the cost buy only having to buy the new shells but many people would probably still by the retention system so they could have multiple options — small of the back, or cross draw.
Not sure if that makes sense or not but my 1.5 cents worth.
I already tortured Dennis once, I’m not gonna do it again!!
I just realized that I’m pretty boring. Dang.
I’ve noticed with mine that a lot of holsters available for it are actually made for another brand (S&W or Sig, but I haven’t really paid attention recently). The dimensions are about the same, so that a holster made for one seems to fit the other very well.
I swear I’ve seen a system like that advertised somewhere, and using a hybrid like the Crossbreed, but now I can’t remember what brand or where. It’s certainly a good idea.
I’ll agree with everyone else: lights and laser attachments are far under-represented in the holster world, outside of some of the .380 pocket guns with the little Crimson Trace Laserguard units. I’d like a holster that would let me mount a laser on the rail of my PT-145, since I haven’t found a decent lasergrip style one (CT makes a Laserguard for it, but it doesn’t fit models with rails).
I think Taurus is a quite neglected line. However alot of the people who buy them may also go for the economy of a multi fit uncle mikes over a custom piece. I like the idea of the lights/lasers but how do you get down to a basic pattern since there are so many combinaitions.
Tuckable IWB mag carriers. I have been searching and can’t find many.
Makarov. I know quite a few people who have them ut they are rare enough that not many holsters are made for them.
Come up with a custom mold kit like the custom shoe places have. Send it to a customer have them make the negative of their gun. Use that to make a casting. Now you can have a premium product where you are able to make a holster for any firearm in existence. Not just the ones you have invested in casts or blue guns for.
I think casts and blue guns are the biggest deterrent to a custom maker adding a X Brands Model Y to their line up
I am constantly on the lookout for a method to discretely carry a 16″ AR. Nothing’s worked thus far.
So I remain a sheep, a 1911 IWB and a 442, pocket carried on the other side. (in the Nemesis.)
I carry a S&W M&P .40 and am appauled at the tiny selection of holsters. Sure I can find stuff from Comptac (love my MTAC) and I have a holster from fobus that I like but thats about it. Very few leather options and most of the kydex is LEO open carry stuff. No shoulder rigs to speak of. People keep saying that glock 21 rigs will work but I have found that SOME glock 21 rigs work and among glocks the 21 is damm near impossible to find a holster for.
Also I would love an open/ range carry holster for my Ruger Mark II with a compensator on it.
I sort-of doubt it’s something Mr. Badurina is interested in, but truly custom Kydex or Hybrid might be something to add to the line. Nice leather is really nice, but Kydex and hybrids are picking up a great deal of the “type of person who will order a custom holster” demographic. Lots of people do Kydex, but not many of those are skilled artisans.
But really, lights is my #1 suggestion. I don’t know how large the market is, but I do know I’m in month 5 of not being able to carry a 5″ 1911 with a light, with end in sight only when I finally get to the front of a 3-month queue.
You know, you would think being married to a custom holster maker, that I’d be more adventurous in my carry gun and method. Seeing as how I wouldn’t have a problem getting a holster made for most anything. Maybe I should slap a light on my M&P just for the challenge 😉
I’m perfectly willing to demo a tacticle buttcrack holster for an M&045 with a Ka-bar pistol bayonet fixed! 😀
Be careful when you sit. You may get a surgical procedure you did not want.
Well of course it needs to be worn with a tactical kevlar banana hammock…but we all know that! 😉
Well….I never thought my bleary-eyed text msg conversation would be the topic of a blog post…. 🙂
Lights…I was really considering adding that to the custom builds I can do. But, here is the problem…
I get a call from someone wanting a holster for his XD, and he has the Acme Sooper-D-Lux light and laser combo, with infrared option. Now….for me to make a holster for his light attached to an XD, I need a model of the XD, and a model of his exact light.
There are *many* lights out there. Once a holster maker announces that he can make holsters for your heater with a mounted light, he has to make sure that he can deliver on his claim. Dummy models of lights are not readily available. So, most holster makers will defer, because the outlay for real lights to attach to mock-up guns would be huge, and the light/laser aftermarket changes far more rapidly than does the gun market, where new models with slightly different frame variations are produced not nearly as often.
As far as holster makers offering only the most popular of current *gotta-have-it* guns, yes, that is the mindset of well over 75% of the makers out there. They build for the current hot commodity, and when the fad passes and the next Gotta-Have-It comes out, they drop an older model gun, add a newer one, retool, and continue. I’ve gone as far as use Airsoft replicas of discontinued or oddball guns, if an Airsoft was available. Blueguns or other training models are great, but being that they are LEO or military training aids, you’re not going to get a model of a Taurus PT111 from them, because its a consumer-grade handgun, not gov’t or LEO.
And something that most folks just don’t believe, but its true….gun makers have a vested interest in NOT making inert or dummy models of their guns, specifically because they want the holster aftermarket themselves. Most of the bigger names in guns nowadays offer a polycarbonate retention holster at some mid-to-upper price point of their guns. I have called Colt, S&W, and Springfield asking for dummy models for holster building. They all said the same thing, not gonna happen. I’m sure that there is also a liability factor on their end, that if they provide a model, a holster maker makes a leather rig, and some idiot shoots himself in the foot because his finger was on the trigger while he was trying to shove the gun in the holster, they’ll be named as a party in a lawsuit because they supplied the model for a *faulty* holster.
Believe me…I’ve had many lawyers tell me I was nuts trying to get into the holster business, because of the potential product liability involved. Then again, I’ve sold holsters to a few lawyers, so go fig….
@ZK…I have a mock-up of a 1911 with rails (Springer Operator) If you would be willing to ship me your light, I can do you up a holster based on my Talon design. Wouldn’t look exactly like the Talon, but would follow the general shape and contours, tweaked to accommodate the light. And it would only take 8 weeks tops. Much better than 5 months. 🙂
@Pat…I make holster for the Makarov, using either a Bersa Thunder .380 (older style) or a Sig P230, both of which are practically identical to the Mak. Never had anyone say their Mak didn’t fit properly. Will have to look into a custom mold kit to send to folks so they can cast negatives. Only problem would be that folks would all want to have their guns cast, but then never order a holster, and the expense on a *maybe I’ll get a sale* falls on me…I’m not big enough yet to absorb that kind of outlay without going bankrupt.
@lissa….you didn’t torture me dear….I’m still going back to that every so often and still playing with the concept.
Thanks for the feedback, folks. Believe me, alot of what you all have mentioned has crossed my mind more than once.
Wow…this went rather long. Sorry for cluttering up the reply queue…
Warmest Regards,
Dennis aka: Dragon
Thanks for the offer; but you’ve actually run into the major problem holster-makers have with light-railed 1911s: the Springfield Operator doesn’t have the same dimensions as, for example, Caspian Recon frames. Oddball 1911s are a nightmare.
@Dragon,
I did not realize the mak fit in those. I do not have one so never truely researched it.
I would do it the other way around for casting. Someone paces the order for a talon or other model for a model that holsters are hard to come by for. Once the order is placed you send the kit. When you’re done with the holster you keep the casting and add it to your ability to make holsters for.
The benefit to them is they get a good quality holster for their gun you get a little extra for the time involved (as a custom service) and you get to keep the casting.
The biggest problem would be finding a material that would accurately mold to the gun but be easy to use by the customer.
I will admit I dabble in Kydex and Leather but for personal use only. My day job and kids keep me way too busy to do any more than that.
Ayup…the grandaddy of the Bersa Thunder .380 / Sig P230 / Makarov / Radom P-64 (Polish-made variant) and any other similar gun is the venerable Walther PPK, or the James Bond gun. (it was the standard carry in James Bond flicks for a number of years.) Knock-offs of the Walther can be found all over the place, and they are all VERY close in size/shape, so much so that I can fit almost any variant with only my actual Bersa or the Bluegun Sig P230.
If all things go well It’ll be a P64 for a BAG day gun!
WANT!
How about an ankle rig for a Kahr P9 and one for a Glock 26/27/33 ? I wear 8″ boots and jeans…
As for odd carry, I’ve been known to slip a Baby Browning behind a pack of Cigarettes in a shirt pocket, but that’s for unique circumstances. I prefer a Vertical Shoulder rig, since I’m behind the wheel a lot, and if I have to use a Rest Stop for #2, it’s a pain to keep a waist holster out of sight/out of mind. But I’ll probably be doing some business with Mr. Dragon in Pittsburgh, ’cause what I want is going to have to be a Custom Job.
I have a Colt 1908, you could probably fit that diminutive little fucker INTO an empty pack of smokes.
Hey how do you carry your Baby Browning? My Colt is a total safe queen, but I’ve always contemplated the best way to carry it. The safety is pretty crude, the Colt has a Grip safety that the Browning doesn’t ….
What about magazine carriers? I have a nice tuckable IWB holster for my P3AT, but I could use a good-but-discrete OWB mag carrier to go with it. Something that could pass as a cell phone or a multi-tool holster on casual inspection, and nice enough that it could be worn in a shirt & tie environment. Maybe with an option to wear it horizontally instead of vertically, for comfort.