Weer'd World

This is really a good quote:

If you gun banners are not willing to play by the rules and attempt the necessary amendment on something this important, why should I trust that you obey the law in any lesser pursuit? Why should I think that a contract with one of you is worth the paper it is printed on?

The current debate on if such-and-such gun control is constitutional or infringement on the 2nd Amendment is a big one. Of course nothing in the Bill of Rights is a Carte Blanche rule that ALL behavior enumerated is off limits. You have the freedom of speech, the press, and religion, but you can’t commit slander, libel, incite riots, or declare that raping children is your “religion”. You have the right to not have unlawful searches and seizures, but again the law stipulates when such practices ARE legal.

I of course see the right to keep and bear arms as limited ONLY in how those arms are use. Yep I think you can build a machine gun out of scrap metal for a hobby, or even for personal protection, still it is NOT legal for me to murder my neighbor (with said machine gun, or with a single-shot target rifle), or mow down the cops as they serve me with a lawful warrant.

Still the debate hasn’t gotten there. Right now the pro-gun side is standing on allowing the people to lawfully keep and bear arms if they aren’t disqualified by a court of law, and so long as those guns are considered “In Common Use”.

The other side considers just about anything they’ll pin their name on as “Reasonable Restrictions”, and are for piling on more and more authority to the government on what arms can be kept, and where one can bear them.

Of course on the anti-gun side the easiest way to move on is to repeal the 2nd Amendment. It’s not EASY to do, but it’s been done before, and given that they claim that 90+% of Americans support whatever hobby horse they trot out, if they are telling the truth (yeah, I know!) it WOULD be easy to repeal the 2nd Amendment.

Hell look at our Brother’s to the North. Canada has no right to arms. Doesn’t mean Canadians had all their guns seized, or they can’t go hunting.

Of course they don’t attempt this because A) the 90% numbers are a lie, and B) They see Canada as just a big a problem as America, and the anti-gunners in Canada would love to make possession of a firearm by any non-government entity a crime.

This is of course the big reason why anti-gun groups stifle any means of comments, debate, or response by anything they deem “Opposition”. Anti-Gunners, and “Progressives” in general do not believe in Negative rights. They believe in Positive rights, ie forcing doctors to render free or discounted services to those who cannot compensate them, or forcing tax payers to feed people who refuse to even attempt to support themselves. In other words the Rights I support are those where the government may not act, while their philosophies ride on government taking action against things they declare as “Bad”.

From Joan:

Interesting point. I wonder if even then, the people who are opposed to expanding background checks would be on board. After they were reassured and with specific language in the bill that was voted on in the Senate that there could be NO registration, the NRA still opposed the bill.

Well except that’s another lie.

Go ahead an re-read my post on the GOP compromise to Universal Background checks. It had it’s flaws, but this was the first major bill I’m aware of to offer what would be an honest-to-god Common Sense background check bill.

The anti-gun Forces (also note these are people Joan has intimate ties with, so I doubt she was unaware of this bill) were AGAINST this. The only logical reason why the pro-gun side and anti-gun side didn’t get together to debate this is that the reasons the anti-gun side is after “Universal Background Checks” is a bad faith argument. They aren’t interested in cutting down bad people getting guns, they’re interested in whittling down GOOD people with guns through registrations, more ambiguous denials of rights, and adding pay gates and time constraints that will frustrate all but the most ardent gun nut.

They aren’t interested in public safety or enforcing the law, they’re interested in banning guns.

So Miguel and many others are expressing distaste in this image:

It’s fake, it’s stupid, and it does our side no good. Still it’s amazing what the other side will say:

Warning. Gun sales to felons domestic abusers, terrorists and those who are adjudicated mentally ill people are legal in America. Yes. It’s true.

NO IT IS NOT!

After the Sandy Hook shooting in 2012, Congress had an opportunity to expand background checks at the federal level.

First up the Sandy Hook shooting was done with STOLEN guns. Here in Massachusetts we have “Universal Background Checks”, and oddly enough criminals and other undesirable elements still get guns. They break multiple laws to do so, and they don’t care. Still to own a gun here you need to pay several hundred dollars to get a permit, and re-up $100 every 5 years to keep above board. You know, to keep those poor people in crime-infested neighborhoods disarmed. Maybe they could afford an old S&W Model 10 or a used shotgun, or maybe they could have inherited one from a friend or family member, but they’d be spending so much money just to legally own it, let alone shoot it (requiring gun club membership and dues in the Eastern part of the state).

Meanwhile the deceptions offered by the corporate gun lobby when they oppose common sense gun measures need to be exposed for what they are. Let’s be clear. Expanding background checks to private sales will not lead to gun registration or gun confiscation. The fact that these same background checks performed in millions of gun sales since the Brady law passed in 1994 have not led to gun registration or confiscation lends the lie to the assertions by the gun lobby.

Except it has. There is a national registry, in places where there are private sales it isn’t an actionable one, but in places where “Universal Background checks” have been passed there sure was confiscation. Further Joan WANTS there to be door-to-door confiscation, like her above statements, she is LYING!

Gun background checks save lives. Why? Because if we just let anyone legally buy guns, then just about anyone and everyone will legally buy guns. The thing is, just about anyone CAN legally buy guns in the U.S. because we aren’t stopping them.

Yep again a LIE! It is NOT legal for prohibited people to buy guns. It is a crime for them to acquire or own a gun in any means, so what’s one more law for them to break going to do.

Also note she cites NOTHING claiming it SAVES lives. It saves lives BECAUSE SHE SAYS SO. Oh and she’s a liar, so we know how good her word is.

He wasn’t supposed to have a gun but have a gun he did. How did he get it? There are ways. As the gun rights extremists say, criminals will always find a way to get a gun. But why in the world do we make it easy for them to get guns? Yes there is a black market for guns but how did those guns get into the black market in the first place given that all guns start out as legal purchases?

There, she tips her hat quite a bit. This law won’t stop ANYBODY from getting a gun who wants one badly enough to break the law for it. Same way people get illegal drugs. So yeah, the law will do little to deter those who are already breaking the law, or who plan to break more serious laws, like the law against murder.

As for all guns starting out as legal purchases. That isn’t true. Criminals hire straw buyers, and we have stories like this. But still note what Joan is getting at. She isn’t concerned about background checks, she’s concerned about PRIVATE OWNERSHIP OF FIREARMS.

Again, she wants them all confiscated.

So again, the Brady law passed in 1994. Since that time, federally licensed firearms dealers (FFLs) have been submitting records of sales to the FBI’s National Instant Check System. It takes a few minutes for the person on the phone to approve or disapprove of a gun sale. Since the law passed, about 2 million people have been stopped from buying a gun from a FFL. But now, due to the insane number of guns being purchased, the system is overtaxed and flawed, allowing some who may not be legally able to buy a gun to get one anyway. Clearly we need to fix the system and then expand what we are doing. Lives depend on us getting this right. At the least, we need to make sure all of the records of felons, adjudicated mentally ill people and domestic abusers are sent to the FBI background check system.

Another lie . Further she cites the system being “overtaxed”, but her “Solution” is to tax it more by requiring MORE purchases to go through that same system. She’s talking pure anarchy at this point.

Just pure lies, but it’s for the sake of an evil agenda, so it’s worth it to her!